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My feedback and general suggestions

Discussion in 'Suggestions' started by Zoram, Feb 3, 2012.

  1. Zoram

    Zoram Whitelisted Player

    Since Kane locked the thread about why people aren't as active on godcraft anymore, I will leave my post here(in the second post) and my suggestions to improve the server in general in this first post. Some things will over lap, and it will be a lot of reading. Sorry about that. I will try to keep it as clean as I can muster.

    Preface to @Kane:
    Dear Kane, I know how it feels to take criticism, it doesn't make you feel good, and though you often dismiss it as trolling and butt-hurt ragers, there are some valid points, but I don't believe you can make change by insult, so I will present this with respect for everyone, and with the wellfare for the longevity of the server in mind, I do not know what costs/effort goes into the server, so this all comes from a somewhat blind perspective, but I hope that you start to consider what Myself and others desire and have to say. One thing I like to observe and analyze is how videogame mechanics work, and I would be happy to work to make godcraft work better, hence this thread.

    Preface to everyone:
    This is how I would have things be, I am not proposing it be my way entirely, but if we find the best way for the server's longevity, I am hoping collectively with good ideas, we can find new things and better ways. Don't entirely dismiss any idea, always give reasons why otherwise no progress can be made.

    1.First of all, we need to actually test new things.

    One thing that is driving me mad right now, is that we have no enchanting. Another is that PvP needs help to be fun for real player interaction. I have also suggested twice the mod/plug-in whatever you call it, that allows for extra pictures and for pictures to be cycled through to quickly find the one you want, but I am not the only one, and it isn't the first time. I think we could not only improve the server faster, but it could be fun for players to test things out more.

    2.re-evaluate the way Godcraft gets money.

    I know, I have really no right, and no say on this one, but I see it as very daunting to any new players. For me, it was $10 for minecraft, $10 for godcraft, and then $5 for pre-purchase pvp and $10 for nether. That alone, is $35 for a game that (in my opinion) never made it out of the alpha phase. That is not bad. It is on par, I will tack on the $10 VIP2 I bought for shop signs alone. $45 for Godcraft and minecraft. But minecraft is now full price, it is like $30 USD. $40 in total just to get on Godcraft. Nether and PvP is $20 extra and they aren't the most appealing features at the moment. PvP without good PvP, and nether without nethery things, it isn't right feeling, and if it were me, I don't know if I would pay. In my post below that was intended for the other thread, I talk about it more. The way I see it, the pricing is scary for new comers and I think a solution could be to have something that is a full on feature of the server but be something that is a renewable cost that isn't PvP. I was thinking that making extra worlds require a low monthly fee for access might work, over a one time fee. Anyhow, just something that is daunting and to be considered for newcomers.

    3.re-evaluate VIP

    Again, in my post below I talk about it more. But I don't think it is right at all to make shop signs a VIP thing, it feels wrong. I see VIP as a celebratory reward to those who donate, not as something that you need if you want to protect the items you sell. I find it might work better to have VIP be a stagnant thing. If a player donates money, as they donate, they get a higher permanent VIP status. Basically I am suggesting that VIP's renewable status be swaped with the status of bonus worlds as a form of income, but again, I have no real say. But it seems more right. If VIP 1 were a total of $10 donated, VIP2 over $30 donated, and VIP3 over $50 donated, or something to that effect. Of course these are high because they would be permanent status's for players, and the benefits would change. I don't think shop signs, which is a safety feature should be part of VIP benefits. I also think that the warps should be their own thing. things like the stone kit and 8k warps seem more like some sort of premium status, but I would feel a bit more okay with some of it, if VIP were a status for donations that stay with your account permanently, not as a month to month thing. Again, this is dealing with money, so I understand, but it doesn't feel like VIP as it is now.

    4.more stuff.

    I'm not on the cutting edge of what server plugins there are these days, but I don't believe for a second, that there aren't interesting mods out there that impact us players and give us a new lease on godcraft, a new fun twist, or something to ease the flaws in the vanilla game. Again, like I said, there is a huge need for something to improve PvP. I don't care what anyone says, PvP died after the fearsome 5 killed everyone enough times, and blew everything up to a point where no one bothered anymore. There are several issues with the pvp system(or lack thereof). I know there is stuff out there to keep it fresh for us, or at least improve what we have.

    5.interpersonal relationships.
    This is huge. If people are mean, no one will want to be here. We poke fun at each other, but we also tend to hurt each other...a lot. Kane, Admins, mods, and the average player, we all need to stop being rude. If one person feels offended, I think it goes a long way to just stop and say sorry. We have some egotism that has crept in, and I think we need to be kind in the first place, and treat each other well. I know a lot of people don't like certain people, and we all just need to say sorry to one another, and also to forgive. But beyond that, just don't be obnoxious, don't be rude in the first place....Kane I know that is something that you should work on, a lot of people get offended by you. Although, yes they can't do anything, it has alienated lots of people. I don't know how many people have been banned due to behavior, but how many of those were exacerbated to perma-ban or ban by people continuing their taunts or being un-yeilding?

    So there are my feelings for now. I would like to see Godcraft not die, but to flourish with fun, fresh new things, and fresh new people and loyal players.
     
    featherblade2, bennerkaj and jcup24 like this.
  2. Zoram

    Zoram Whitelisted Player

    Drama is gay by the way guys, I found that out myself, no reason to further deter players. However I must note that more drama is Kane related than anything else...just saying, everyone knows you could act more civil, kind and professional. There is plenty of room to improve there, a reason why players in the past have left has certainly been attitude.

    I will tell you what kept me from returning for so long in part.

    I got bored. Godcraft is great in one sense, it is secure, stable, organized. However outside that, it is very much just vanilla minecraft with plug ins that fill in the holes Notch decided to neglect. Honestly I didn't feel inclined to return, even after I cooled off. Godcraft and its people have evolved as has the minecraft community at large, but Godcraft hasn't changed much in terms of how it is run, and the features.

    One feature for example is PvP. Remember how many people were excited for the PvP world? IF you do you rmember we were so excited we melted the server. Soon a single roaving gang of PvP players doused the fun of everyone else and PvP died. Now it is just a resource world where mobs fail to spawn, and players don't bother to use it for combat. This is a large debate, and honestly I think as Godcraft, we would need to invent a PvP system, and get a custom made mod so that PvP works. You said once that having an arena mod wasn't a good idea because you didn't like how far from vanilla it was(or so I believe) but I don't think anyone cares, we want PvP that is more than ambushes with iron armor and diamond swords as it is now. http://godcraft.com/threads/the-ideal-pvp-plugin.9537/ just revive this conversation if you want, this conversation is big, and I can draft up a few "base" ideas if you want on different ways I can see PvP going.

    Kane's seeming lack of enthusiasm. This is kind of part of the idea that godcraft isn't evolving into more. But it just felt like Kane was more interested in other games all the time, and seemed to forget the server for minecraft, like your heart isn't in it like it once was. But then again, I don't really know, but it is what it seems like. Currently I am just waiting for news on XP orbs, brewing, enchanting, and potions along with a PvE world. I understand some things cause issues, but I get anxious, and with no news, or reports on "why not" and "this is broken" or "this is exploitable" then I am left to worry.

    VIP is not what I think most people(myself included) think of as well implimented. To me VIP should be some flourishes given to players who donated. But The one big thing I have always had an issue with is that shop signs are VIP only. This is a security feature. Without it, Anyone could just up and steal out of a chest. Sure you can ban a person who steals, but everything about having the feature, and not letting everyone use it seems cheap and irresponsible. It can easily prevent thefts, and make transactions easier for all. What I do think is correct is things like, hats, colored signs, and /me I even think /top is okay.

    Obtaining of money. I am only slightly bitter on this point, however to new players, the prices are unfair and daunting. $10 for the whitelist is great, I approve of that. However $10 just for a single world access and the VIP system as is, is just unsettling, and I honestly didn't like the idea. Everyone has different ideas, but this is just me. I personally think that it would be wise to make add on worlds(PvP, nether, PvE and others to come) should be at most $6 USD per world, and then have a bundle that lets players buy all of them for a small discount. I bought PvP for $5 and it felt right at the time. The way I see it then, you could charge for a convenience add on, which would be permenently unlocking the /8k warps, /pvp and /nether, but that is just me. I know there is need for monthly income, but I think a different way needs to be found. If Non-build worlds had more pizzaz, they would appeal more. Torchwall was fun, I wouldn't mind a new torchwall or the old one... :)

    Lack of certain features and new and old game features in general. I remember at one point we tested out a few mods, like the MCMMO mod, it felt good to test out mods, but I see the suggestions forum, and I don't see anything really being looked at and tested, but then again I don't really know what is going on behind the scenes.

    I will close with this: It is scary to ask/communicate with kane. I often ask sniper and electrobot about the serious issues and how to fix them/what the plans are, and they don't always know, and I dare not ask kane. It may help to give us a better idea of what goes on and what the plans are in front page posts or in informal forum threads more. It feels like our ideas are tossed aside, but I feel bad saying anything about it. I see why sounas is angry he is fed up, but I want godcraft to work, because I don't want to spend more money on another server that is or isn't better, plus I like what we have, we have amazing things, and they are done %100 legit which I LOVE. But I think the first step is mending old wounds. We all need to make nice, and move forward and have Kane be less scary, and well less kane, and try to represent better what makes godcraft awesome. Kane, you have a reputation outside godcraft, trust me, I was reluctant to join in the first place because I had heard things. But I say that ONLY so you know, and that you, and us(the godcraft community) can regain numbers, and get back to being pretty dang awesome.

    /huge post.
     
    featherblade2 likes this.
  3. ColtonisWright

    ColtonisWright Whitelisted Player

    One quick thing about the PvP thing. If enchanting became enabled (with fortune and other rigged enchantments disabled (not silk touch)) and experience was only obtainable in PvP, you would see MANY people there. There would be TONS of people PvPing for those xp levels.
     
    marvinbek likes this.
  4. Zoram

    Zoram Whitelisted Player

    would also make people want to get PvE for xp orbs. I THINK the issue is that if you die and drop like 50 levels of orbs, it causes the server to crash or something. But again, there has got to be a mod that makes you drop like a fraction of orbs or something. Anyhow, Enchanting would be so much fun, and give us tools to use. Also, fortune isn't rigged...

    But again, I could go into more detail if I was chatting live, I thought about it a bit. Sadly I have no way to do anything, only kane can make the final say in what will end up being looked at, but If I was able to calmly and seriously talk with him...it could help I think. I didn't go into detail here very much at all.
     
  5. Kane

    Kane Server Administrator Staff Member

    I do agree a bit with you on some the costs mainly the worlds. I think rather then just $5 for life maybe here and there offer cheap day or something like that where people can finally grab the worlds they wanted but will look into the more in the future. But before you are like aww... I am considering making a PVP or a PVE world free but not just to us but to the world. Bring in new blood and etc and trying promote bring people to the GC community.

    I was thinking this for a new server but why when we want to get more people on our server not a third server.

    Also as much as some dislike VIP majority of active players do like VIP and I think were going to actually enhance it a bit overtime. I also want to give you stats that 90% of the vip users are vip3 and about 10% are 1 and 2.
     
    ReggAbac likes this.
  6. Kane

    Kane Server Administrator Staff Member

    No actually (that was fixed) But we did not enable them because we were not sure what to do with the new silktouch and stuff. But were highly reconsidering that now with 1.1 and 1.2 nearing and our ideas about the PVE world.
     
  7. ColtonisWright

    ColtonisWright Whitelisted Player

    Xp orbs should stay out of PvE. I could sit at a mob grinder with no risk of dieing. But in a PvP world, anyone can come up and kill me. If it's small enough atleast.

    Edit:
    If you enable silk touch, make sure you disable ice placement in the nether.
     
  8. Zoram

    Zoram Whitelisted Player

    then does that mean we can turn on the test server and start testing different things?

    So since then shop signs are VIP2, will you just unlock it for all players? Because that seems to be what you were saying. Sorry if I misunderstand.
     
  9. Kane

    Kane Server Administrator Staff Member

    No it does not. We don't just turn the server and test different things. Were actually in the middle of a total revamp of every mod and every plugins we use as we speak. This change takes days if not weeks to go through and test things internally before I can put a test server online.


    About Shop Signs almost everyone had VIP3 for that. $5 offers a lot more and so a lot players are encouraged to go 3 then 2. So no that is are prime seller. People not paying for VIP3 for pink name after all ;)
     
  10. waythm

    waythm Whitelisted Player

    I won't lie, I pay it for /top.
     
    confuzzledyma likes this.
  11. Kane

    Kane Server Administrator Staff Member

    hehe :), It's the little things that people like. If you feel like /top is worth it then it helps the server and you get a nifty command :).

    But people who dislike vip... It's actually a lot better then what other servers due. I'm a strong believer in capping what you can buy. A lot of other servers if you want everything you would end up paying 1000's and 1000's just for everything. a Small MMORPG cost package for a game that uses about 100 times more resources then most MMORPG's is not really that bad.
     
  12. msu957

    msu957 Whitelisted Player

    I would play alot more if godcrafts pvp server was free, it would make it alot more fun
     
  13. Kane

    Kane Server Administrator Staff Member

    Yeah this is our hope soon to make PVP Free for the world ;)
     
  14. Zoram

    Zoram Whitelisted Player

    so then what happens to people who bought PvP for $10 and pre-purchased for $5?

    Also, about that VIP for shop signs. I get it you need money, and that people get VIP for extra stuff, but that is the one thing I want to ask about above all. The other things were just to see how people felt.
     
  15. Sniper3

    Sniper3 Whitelisted Player

    They still get what they paid for. It's just like seeing an old game in a 99¢ bargain bin that you paid $49.99 for.

    Sadly, there really isn't anything else legit out there that people could want. I have to say, our server is one of the safest servers as far as people stealing, and we even have a relief fund going as well. People just pay for the extra security and convenience.
     
  16. ElectroBot

    ElectroBot Head Moderator Staff Member

    They got early access (for up to a half a year or more).
     
  17. Zoram

    Zoram Whitelisted Player

    Not to be a dick, but to sell on a shop plot without hop signs means unprotected chests, which is safety. I could argue that lockette is the same and should be a convenient VIP feature. I see them as the same thing. We could put a sand block over the chest, but that really isn't sane when there is a plug in to provide complete safety. I have been stolen from many many times from my shop plot in trade 2.0 and that pissed me off. It feels more like an ultimatum than a feature to pay for.

    Sorry, that is just how I feel, its like the one thing I %110 disagree with about the server as it is and feel like I can't adapt to.

    On a nicer note, I would love it if you guys looked at the PvP system and posted in the PvP thread so that we can maybe find a way to make pvp not suck for actual player vs player combat.
     
    jcup24 likes this.
  18. Zoram

    Zoram Whitelisted Player

    I went through the list of craftbukkit mods to find various mods I think could be fun. I know you said that you were entirely overhauling, but then again, what does it hurt? I narrowed it down from like 2000 mods to the ones I felt would be fun or useful, but of course these are opinions, and some are less vital than others.

    1.SIMPLE CLANS
    http://dev.bukkit.org/server-mods/simpleclans/

    This mod allows for a clan system that is pretty simple and not all parts of it need ot be used. Why I liked it was that it wasn't dependent on other mods and it has clan friendly fire options and the ability to officially declare wars.

    2.COMBAT TAG
    http://dev.bukkit.org/server-mods/combat-tag/

    If one player hits another player, and the player hit tries to log out within a configurable time, they essentially do not escape death by logging out like a jerk. They will die anyway.

    3.MOB AGE
    http://dev.bukkit.org/server-mods/mobage/
    Would solve the problem I brought up in General discussion

    4.PVP +
    http://dev.bukkit.org/server-mods/pvpplus/

    Allows you to configure aspects of player death, looting respawning and such.

    5.CITIZENS
    http://dev.bukkit.org/server-mods/citizens/

    Allows for the creation of NPCs with different roles, that interact with players, bringing the PvP world(or even build world) to life.

    6.MENDEL'S SHEEP
    http://dev.bukkit.org/server-mods/mendels-sheep/

    Not really a big deal, but it changes how bred sheep colors are determined to be more realistic with Genotypes and Phenotypes. Would really only apply to me in most cases...So not a big deal, just found it neat.

    7.EXP BANK
    http://dev.bukkit.org/server-mods/expbank/

    There are several experience storage and exchange plugins, this one seemed the most logical, but even if it isn't there are others to choose from. This of course would only come into play when we enable experience.

    8.CHANGE SILKTOUCH
    http://dev.bukkit.org/server-mods/changesilktouch/

    a simple mod that allows you to enable and disable blocks affected by silktouch, and to change what actual item you get from it. You could easily disable ice, or even make a dirt block drop a diamond ore if you were crazy enough.

    9.SKYRIM RPG(Beta)
    http://dev.bukkit.org/server-mods/skyrimrpg/

    I honestly don't know if a complex RPG plug in is for us, and there are plenty of them out there, but this one seems modest and logical, since it is based on the skyrim style which is very clean. It is beta so I'd say just watch it, but I don't know if a complex added combat system is good unless we get it custom built.

    10.BATTLENIGHT
    http://dev.bukkit.org/server-mods/battlenight/

    This is similar to the "WAR" mod. I don't know if this one has a built in system to keep combatents in, and non-combatents out or not, but what makes it different is that this one allows for players to pick a class from the start that we can set up ourselves. The War mod is also similar, but I think the WAR mod is much safer, I guess you'd need to test both to get a better idea.

    11.MOBS
    http://dev.bukkit.org/server-mods/mobs/

    Allows you to customize just about anything about the mobs, essentially rebalancing mobs. If we find mobs fine as they are I'd say it wouldn't be needed, but it could be very useful indeed. It has a lot of features.

    12.WAR
    http://dev.bukkit.org/server-mods/war/

    So yeah there it is, the war mod. When I first suggested it, it was for hMod and had some exploits, but now I think its more refined. It would allow for PvP combat in isolated zones. and isolates all those in combat from people not in combat. If PvP won't be for money anymore, we could allow this in build for permenent "for fun" fighting, whereas PvP world would be for keeps. I really really REALLY want to build combat zones. Please consider it, I'd love to help test.

    13.HORDE
    http://dev.bukkit.org/server-mods/horde/

    allows you to change under what circumstances mobs spawn and some other things. I don't know whether or not the MOBS plug in can do that too, but I think it does everything this one can and more, but I'm not sure.

    14.EASY ENCHANT
    http://dev.bukkit.org/server-mods/easyenchant/

    Allows for the player to easily enchant the item with exactly what they are looking for instead of waiting for the right enchantment to pop up. Saves the player time when enchanting. It doesn't seem to be UI based, it seems to be chat based, so it might be a bit confusing or annoying, but it could certainly be worth it.

    15.MORE PAINTINGS
    http://godcraft.com/threads/more-painting-the-simple-mod-for-well-more-paintings.9622/

    It isn't on bukkit.org as far as I could see, but it is a really nice mod. I have pushed this one a few times before.


    So there it is, a list of things I found, I'm sure there are some better options that do the same thing, and some may not be right for us. I kept in mind that it should keep things very close to vanilla, and keep things fun, but not crazy confusing or too over the top. So tell me what you think, link me more things if you find things you think might work.
     
    aliparpar and Piekiller like this.
  19. IamRacecaR

    IamRacecaR Whitelisted Player

    Horde mode! Perpetual siege! True survival test!
     
  20. ColtonisWright

    ColtonisWright Whitelisted Player

    Please don't implement #7. Xp is ment to be lost when you die...
     

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